It certainly is a strange week for sex on daytime, isn't it?
Most of the week, soap fans, the soap press, bloggers, mainstream media, and probably a few Conservative Right groups are a-buzz about the Nuke sex over on As the World Turns. Meanwhile, today on One Life to Live? Dorian gave an implied... um... "job" to David Vickers at the end of today's episode.
Okay, so I know what you're going to say. You're going to say "Tom! It's David and Dorian! It's funny! Laugh!"
I love David and Dorian. I can watch Tuc Watkins and Robin Strasser take turns reading computer instructions to each other, and enjoy every minute of it. But never mind the fact that ATWT is fighting to even show a kiss, while ABC is showcasing oral sex. Never mind the whole "Where's love in the afternoon?" argument. Here's what bothered me - Dorian found out David is a Buchanan, and wants to get him back before he finds out, so she can get her hands on the money. So in order to do that? She did... this. In other words, Dorian Lord got on her knees for money.
I may not be the world's leading expert on Dorian Lord, but to me, this negates any dignity and class the character has. Sure, Dorian would do a lot of things to get her hands on that fortune (and she has!), but the implication of getting down on one's knees seems beneath her to me.
When Todd and Marty kissed last summer, I wrote a blog entry about the importance of direction in scenes like this. It disturbed me that Todd was the dominating force in that kiss, going so far as to be standing over Marty when it happened and it would have been less disturbing to watch had Marty been in a dominant position... or at least less reminiscent of the rape.
I had the same issue here. Watching Dorian try and seduce David is one thing, but bearing witness as she got on her knees for him diminished her character so much in my eyes. My issue here had nothing to do with writing - but with the direction of the scene. I understand it was being played for comedy, but Dorian is a far greater icon on this show, who deserved better than to be pushed underneath a Buddhist robe. She is a force to be reckoned with - not a high-class hooker.
There's comedy... and then there's just degrading one of the strongest women on soaps today. There were a hundred better ways to shoot this scene - because my Dorian Lord? She doesn't get on her knees for anybody.
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Wow, just Wow! I agree with you, Tom. I haven't watched OLTL in almost 3 months, but to do this to the character of Dorian Lord is just wrong. I'll have to watch a clip of this but just from your description, this is not the love in the afternoon I prefer to watch.
I'm going to agree with you 89%, but does Dorian ever REALLY have class? I mean, she's always been money-grubbing and trying to make herself out to be a sophisticated, high society woman while nobody really respects her. We already saw her compromise when she poured liquor down Charlie's throat, even though it was something she would NEVER do if Mel were still around. And Dorian's also attracted to David; we know this because of their history. So yes, I do see where you are coming from but I really wouldn't put it past Dorian Lord to get on her knees.
I see why you and others had a problem with the scene today. It does kind of tarnish the role of the classy woman OLTL, and she herself, has made Dorian Lord out to be. However, did you ever hear the saying, "a lady in the streets, but a freak in the sheets?" That sums up Dorian for me after today's show. I thought it was hilarious and classic. Dorian's a little freak and she knew that she had to act fast to get to David and she knew exactly wehre to [i]hit[/i] him...where it counts!
You're a prude, Tom.
Number one: this is not the first "implied" blowjob on daytime television.
Number two: Dorian - and innumerable other daytime characters - has done plenty worse for money than give a blowjob to a man with whom she's long shared a complicated, on-again/off-again love. And to imply that the giving of oral sex is somehow demeaning to Dorian (who is, I feel the need to remind you, a fictional character) says far more about your sexual mores than about hers. And that is just plain sad.
You do realize, or maybe that's assuming you have a brain, that you really are burning any and every bridge you may have still had in the ever-shrinking world of daytime TV and will never work there again? Right? That is your point? Because if that is not your point, what the bloody hell is?
i dont think she *is* doing it for the money; i think she sees it as the ultimate F*U to VIKI & CLINT!
btw, i thought it was *HOT*!!!
GET IT, DORIAN!
...*but* i respect your views, Tom!
I think Dorian and David are a match made in heaven. I don't think she actually got on her knees just for the money - it was about revenge, and part of her still loves David (I actually think they're soulmates) - so I don't think I read the scene the same way you did, but I can certainly see your point.
DrewH said ... However, did you ever hear the saying, "a lady in the streets, but a freak in the sheets?"
Now, I never heard that one, but I am trying like crazy to remember the way I heard it, which undoubtedly is the forerunner of this one, because it was around so long ago, ... lady in the dining room but whatever in the bedroom ...
Tom, I see you point.
Having sex with David and using it in the bigger scheme of things? That's Dorian. But there is something about the way it was staged that does diminish Dorian a bit. Dorian doesn't crawl on her knees to any man - she has THEM in the palm of her hands (or, um, wherever).
I do agree with Lee that Dorian was more compromised when she liquored Charlie up.
And yeah, it's a frickin' ludicrous double standard between any straight soap couple and Nuke or Rianca.
I just watched it & I didn't have a problem with it. But, I don't find sexual acts between 2 consenting adults demeaning, basically, although, sure I bet there are some that I would still not want to see on TV, perhaps. But, I don't find oral sex that is not graphically portrayed to fall into that category.
Now, when the case was GL's Gus & he'd just brought Harley home from the hospital & she couldn't move much at all & they kissed & then Gus moved down with some dialogue supporting the 'implied', it wasn't being played for comedy, it was romantic, tender, hot, ...
My problem in today's soaps and 'Love in the Afternoon' being MIA is all about soaps, in general, not doing romance anymore! But, doing romance would require more time spent on certain kinds of scenes.
Not that it matters but it wouldn't have made it better, to me, if Marty had initiated the kiss. Because I know you don't mean that Marty would have initiated a kiss & Todd stopped it from happening! Because that's probably the only thing that would have made it better to me. In a way it would have been even ickier in another way if Marty had initiated the kiss. (And 'ickier' is not nearly a strong enough word.)
But, you bring up a question for me. Is it not possible that issues like that could be in the writing, as opposed to after the pages left the writers?
However, I do think it was shot the way it was to support the comedy they were presenting. Dorian was tempting & seducing David. Surely oral sex wasn't new to them.
And, I guess I never thought of Dorian as one of the strongest women on daytime.
And, do you think that if a woman gives a BJ that means she's a high-class hooker at best?
If Dorian & David were two men, or two women, do you think you would have the same reaction?
And, about your saying, "But never mind the fact that ATWT is fighting to even show a kiss, ... "
Luke & Noah have kissed a lot & often, after they went through an absurdly long time between the day of first kiss(es) and the day of second kiss(es).
I don't buy the premise that getting down on her knees to perform one of the world's most enduringly popular sins makes Dorian weak. It just means she's got solid technique. I give her a 10.0.
The most explicit implied oral sex I ever saw on soaps occurred between a towel-clad Victor Webster and Lauren Koslow on Days. Couldn't believe they got away with it. Gave me the vapors.
i didnt think it was gross!
i'm ***THRILLED*** to see A Woman Of A Certain Age get some HOT Buddhist action!!!!
What's the point in again comparing Nuke and a heterosexual couple? Yes, ATWT is "fighting" to show a kiss between a gay couple, while OLTL gets a blowjob. All this shock you seem to showcase just makes you seem like you're playing at naivete. No one believes that ATWT and straight couples have the same treatment. The point isn't to say that again and again, the point is to get to a place where eventually that will no longer be true.
As for Dorian, the scene was a very lighthearted moment with a gorgeous man Dorian has always had a playful relationship with. She wasn't exactly doing the business with a homeless man in the bus station bathroom.
Hi Tom,
What bothered me most was Dorian paying Mo a month's salary to leave. I mean please, Mo is her cook, the real Dorian wouldn't care if her employees were around for this!
As far as the act itself, well, this is the woman who drugged Charlie, needed to be prodded by ghost Mel to save Viki's life, and came THIS close to doing the same deed with the Beaver last week (insert your own joke here).
I think the issue here is that RC seems to enjoy putting Dorian in one compromising position after another. It's almost like he's saying, "can Robin Strasser really bring pull this scene off with her dignity in tact this time?" And of course, with Strasser the answer will always be YES!
BTW, this scene was reminiscent for me of Halloween '95, when Dorian tricked a blindfolded David into having sex with her when he thought he was with Blair. The sex games between these two do have a context and history, for better or for worse.
I have to agree. I don't think it's 'prudish' to be concerned about Dorian's destruction, on a show that has increasingly objectified women setting all back at least twenty years (Marty the survivor becoming a lover with the man who raped her).
IF we'd had any indiction that Dorian routinely got freaky with David (as we did with David and Addie) that would be one thing. The implication, in this storyline, is that Dorian did something she would not otherwise do - most especially give their last interaction and David's use of Addie.
Yes, Dorian would do a lot for money. Sell herself? Get on her knees? When did she EVER do anything like that before? We've never seen that from her. I hope to never see it again. If it was JUST a little playful sex, no problem - well, still a little explicit, but it would have been about love between longstanding partners. This was a business transaction.
Damon L. Jacobs said...
The sex games between these two do have a context and history, for better or for worse.
like this...
DORIAN: "He was just showing me how they shot a scene in an old movie..."
DAVID: "I was Jack Nicholson..."
DORIAN: "Right! And I was his..."
DAVID: "...Apple strudel."
Hey there, Norrth. Have you been watching OLTL for very long? Because Dorian and David were always presented as getting their freak on together.
Dorian used sex to con a divorce out of David after Viki's alter had forced them to marry each other in order to save Joey and Tina from Dorian and David respectively. That was when Dorian & Blair dressed up as Marilyn Monroe and switched places. David was tied to the bed and blindfolded. S&M anyone? And after the divorce David begged Dorian to have sex with him again because she was the best sex he'd ever had. They hated each other, but they got it on again. Their origins as a couple are all about sex for financial gain and sex for purely physical pleasure. The love developed long after all of that.
Really, Dorian has always been extremely sexual with every partner, Clint being the most boring...uh...I mean tame.
Speaking of Clint, when D&D got it on at Asa's home in Texas it seemed pretty clear they were implying David was going down on Dorian. And that's happened a number of times I can think of between the two of them.
Dorian is a woman on a mission, and in keeping with her character, she uses whatever in her arsenal she thinks will help her get her goal. I don't have the slightest problem with it. And it's not as though she wouldn't enjoy it. She nearly married David a second time, turn to him for comfort sex when she caught Clint kissing another woman and has expressed being jealous at David with Addie.
I say rock on with your bad self, Dorian. Still sexy after all these years.
This is Dorian's Scarlett O'Hara persona. Didn't anyone else see her fall to her knees after David left yelling at the Heavens, "As God is my witness! I'll get my hands on BE again!" Kudos to La Strasser and Ron Carlivati.
I have always loved David and Dorian. They are amazing together and I would love to see them as a couple again. I had no problem with her actions with David. That said, I truly feel this headwriter does not know how to write Dorian Lord or, quite frankly, multi-dimensional villians (witness the nonsense with Todd and Dorian Lord would not drug Charlie)
This is a character portrayed by a beautiful and brilliant actress and I would love see intelligent material given to her whether it be drama or comedy. Now it appears Dorian will try to trade her fortune for David's, plot to get David to marry her, pretend to be a Buddhist!? No way. Dorian Lord does not need to scrape the bottom of the barrel for BE or this new dull David.
A woman of a certain age shown to be a robustly sexual creature. Entertaining, sexy, temporarily front burner? Let us not complain...
You don't sound like you know diddley about Dorian Lord remembering the hot scenes she had seducing Viki's son Joey many years ago.
It's always been implied that Dorian and David had kinky sex. I guess it didn't seem weird at all to me given their history.
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